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my dad witnessed that catastrophy

Wow! What an awful yet historic thing to see.

The market would support uncapping those wells now. There is probably some endangered species of prairie rat living too close to the wells now, so we can't open them back up.

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Originally posted by drlivingston:

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Originally posted by RichC:
The only thing wrong with the hydrogen idea is

By the way.... the only other thing wrong with hydrogen occured on May 6, 1937, in Lakehurst, NJ.

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As always, no vaseline

Well, it is a petroleum based product.

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Picture of Dave Beers

Posted June 17, 2008 09:44 AM
A thought or two about boycotts...they sound good and make people feel better but they are largely ineffective. After all, the Boston Tea Party didn't cause a tea shortage.

It might not of caused a shortage, but it does get attention. We still remember the Boston Tea Party.

It would not exactly be a boycott. More of a symbolic message.

Dwayne

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More of a symbolic message

Wear a ribbon. It acomplishes the same thing and is less painful.

There must be one on this list that will work. Pretty incredible list. The typical American would look like a war hero if he wore all the awareness ribbons which impacted him or her. Maybe if people spent more time working on some of these issues instead of deciding on a ribbon color, they wouldn't need so many ribbons!

You guys just let me know if you intend to start this trend... I just need 24hr advance notice to place my bid for shares of ribbon company stock... I seem to qualify for about 6 ribbons as it is.

Perhaps I can wear stars or oak leaf clusters on the ribbons, like the military does for multiple awards of the same ribbon.

I wonder if the awareness ribbon gimmick uses the same business model as Hallmark uses for hyping formerly minor occasions as needing a card?

Meanwhile, while printing my boarding passes for our flights to Seattle I had to change ink cartridges. Of course, one of the cut-rate replacements leaked like hell and now my hands are about half magenta. Should be fun at the TSA checkpoint tomorrow. When will I learn to stick with genuine Canon ink?

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Wear a ribbon. It acomplishes the same thing and is less painful. Wink

I wonder if those hosting the Boston Tea Party would have been remember if they had just worn ribbons.
No one remembers the tea that was not dump. It set in warehouses for years.
I think that the "pain" get the attention of the powers to be a little quicker.

I wouldn't equate a boycott over fuel prices with a direct challenge to the the authority of the British Crown to levy taxes. I also have little doubt the Boston Tea Party was embellished a bit by the press at the time, and gained more over the years.

Another point - there is a big difference between the population and economy of then versus now.

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Originally posted by Dave Beers:
Perhaps I can wear stars or oak leaf clusters on the ribbons, like the military does for multiple awards of the same ribbon.

I wonder if the awareness ribbon gimmick uses the same business model as Hallmark uses for hyping formerly minor occasions as needing a card?

Meanwhile, while printing my boarding passes for our flights to Seattle I had to change ink cartridges. Of course, one of the cut-rate replacements leaked like hell and now my hands are about half magenta. Should be fun at the TSA checkpoint tomorrow. When will I learn to stick with genuine Canon ink?

When they lower the price to the same as the generic brand.

The "pain" got to me last night Another $32 fill up.

There is always a worse case. If I still owned my Ford F150 - it had a 36 gallon tank - a fill up from empty would have cost me $145 today.

Since I retired I am driving my VW R32 about 100 miles a month. I just don't need to drive very often. We coordinate more and combine trips using the Accord to maximize our efficiency. Even with the gas prices going higher, our monthly fuel bill has actually gone down a bit. But we pretty much stay around Athens which is 6 miles west and Vanessa's daycare center is mid-way. If I was still working at the Ferry I would have 200 miles a week in transit.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Dave Beers:
and now my hands are about half magenta. [QUOTE]
Ah ha!!! I figured that, one day, we would catch Dave red handed!!

I don't know if he flew to Canada or Washington state, but I'm sure the TSA guys where wondering about his magenta hands .

The ink is a mess! I took my Lexmark cartridge to Walgreen's for the "free re-fill" promotion. They said it had a "failure" of some sort. It seemed to work fine on the way home in my pocket! It ruined my slacks, a new pair of underwear, and my car seat!

Getting back on topic though, the gas seems to have hit it's peak. I just hope they don't think this price range is going to be accepted as the norm. By "they" I mean the speculators who drove the price up. I don't believe there is a shortage of gas. I remember when there was a real shortage of gas, and the price doubled like this. You were only allowed to get gas on odd or even days according to the last number on your license plate. The gas station's would really run out of gas!

I haven't seen anything like that.

Dwayne

Was that the fake one in the 70s? The real one was during WWII. I wasn't alive then, but my dad told me about rationing. In the 70s, the gas stations would run out, but the storage tanks were full. There were freighters anchored off of the coast waiting to off-load, but couldn't because the bunkers were maxed out. I don't believe there is any shortage, it's just greed. Saturday was $4.02/gal., last night it was still $4.02/gal. I think it's the first time in 3 weeks it hasn't gone up at least 5 cents inbetween my fill-ups. I fill up usually on Tuesdays and Saturdays. Sometimes I have to do 3 a week, if I have to go to doctor appointments. I know we'll never see $2.00/gal. gas again, and I doubt we'll see $3.00/gal. I think they're going to push it to $5.00/gal. by the end of the year. I'm surprised they're not doing it now. Summer vacation is the only time for the majority of US families to be able to take a vacation. They seem hell-bent on taking that away from us. It's just not fair, but then no one said anything about being fair.

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I remember when there was a real shortage of gas, and the price doubled like this. You were only allowed to get gas on odd or even days according to the last number on your license plate. The gas station's would really run out of gas!

That shortage was caused not by an oil shortage, there were tankers lined up to offload product that couldn't get into port. It was set in motion when the government decided to set artificial price controls and caps in place. That took the free market, the basis of our system, out of play and put regulations in play, in place of the market. It had disastrous consequences and was thankfully repealed. Even with high pricies today we don't have double digit inflation and unemployment that was the biggest problem in the 70's.

The speculators have driven the pricing to beyond the market value. Anytime that happens there is a correction comming. Remember when the thought was that real estate had no top, that it was the safest and best possible investment. The argument was, "Buy land, they're not making anymore, it has to go up." That created the housing boom and speculators buying land, housing, flipping properties, monkeying with mortgages and creating new ways of lending. Pricing climbed beyond sustainable market values and we entered the housing bust we're seeing the results of today. All those speculators that said there would be no correction, that lending to anyone at todays pricing regardless of the risk on the loans was a no lose situation because the property would be worth more tomorrow and they could profit even if they had to forclose. Those speculators are now stuck with worthles properties they can't sell, banks and mortgage companies stuck with worthless loans they can't collect on. Now I hear talk of bail-outs?!?! Government regulations to fix the problem?!?! Pay off the speculators who bought these properties and are stuck?!?! Yep, it hurt average Americans with their own mortgages as well, their properties dropped right along with the speculators who forced the pricing beyond market values. Who though, do you really think will profit from a bail-out? The average Joe with a single mortgage or those in charge of the banks and others who are well versed in the system and how to capitalize on it no matter which direction things go?

Gas will see a correction, it's simlly the way things work in a free market system. The only way gas pricing will continue to climb and not see the inevitable adjustment is if the government steps in with caps and regulations to try and fix the problem before the market has the chance to. If we do create a real shortage by not seeking new sources, drilling, exploration, conservation, etc the market price may actually reach the levels that the speculators have pushed it to, or higher. Especially with demand worldwide growing. I say lose the ethanol hand outs and requirements that are causing pricing increases on energy and food along with food shortages and do some exploration and drilling. Develop new sources like the upstart shale-oil and clean coal. Put up a couple of nuke plants and refineries. It'll take a while to see the benefits but if we'd taken that course in the 70's when we realized we had a problem we wouldn't have a problem today. Gotta start somewhere.

Cheers, Neil

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Gotta start somewhere

....and sometime. If they had in the 70s, well...we may or may not be in the mess we're in now, but we'll never know. If they start now, maybe in the 20s, they'll know. By the way, my fill up on Saturday was $39.65. For a Versa, geesh!

Our gas is up to $3.97 from $3.88 just a few days ago. Just in time for the July 4th, influx of vacationers.

Dwayne